The Bearded Girl
Q&A with Jody Wilson & Anwen O'Driscoll
THE BEARDED GIRL was my favorite film from the 29th edition of the Fantasia International Film Festival. (Go see my review here)
The fairy-tale like magic wrapped around this coming-of-age story was exactly what I needed to watch this year.
I may be past the growing pains of my youth, but I turned 40 this year. And with it, a lot of changes I was not ready for. Funny how that happens.
And it's even funnier that life threw this gem of a film my way. It was the warm blanket I needed.
So now I'm honored to share my Q&A I was lucky to have with the talented Jody Wilson (writer/director) and Anwen O'Driscoll (actress who plays Cleo).
Theresa Dillon (TD): Jody, why tell a coming-of-age story with a sideshow aspect?
Jody Wilson (JW): I think it has easy visual cues of otherness that anyone can relate to because it's not super personal for any one audience or person so they can safely relate to these characters.
Then there’s these visual otherness cues and devices that tell the story simply. My intention was simple but beautiful and kind of interesting. So, you have this backdrop and palette that's already super beautiful with all of the elements of tents and the colors, and you get to really lean in and be free with your art direction and costumes and all of that juicy stuff that's so nice to look at.
And then you can tell simple stories that have messages in them for people to be able to hopefully relate to, because there's a safe space between the people and the subject matter.
TD: Were you a fan of FREAKS?
JW: Oh yeah, I've seen FREAKS. Interestingly enough, and this surprises people sometimes, I'm not a circus freak. But I love FREAKS. That was a fantastic film. But one of the things, even when we were on set with our art department, anytime someone brought in something that was purple, I would feel like it felt too much like THE GREATEST SHOWMAN. I was like, we can't have that. Even the tent had to be a different color because it had to feel like, “Is it a circus? Is it a freak show? What the heck is this place?”
TD: THE BEARDED GIRL definitely had a different vibe to it, and the way you portrayed it, it felt as if the sideshow had been there a while before you even got some of the backstory of this community, and whether the outside community likes it or not. You also have a common theme of the absence of a strong father figure. What was your intention for making this creative choice?
JW: It's so interesting because I have a very close relationship with my dad, and so I told him before we shot this is “It’s not about you, obviously, dad.” It's just an easy way to talk about feelings of abandonment. Instead of using both parents, it was more of a silent character. He starts the film because on the recording at the beginning, that's his band. So he starts it and then finishes it, because the song that they sing at the end is a re-imagining of that song. He's always there, and Blaze’s dad is always there looming over and it's the patriarchal influence that we feel as women, as men, as children, as everyone.
I'm a feminist, but I'm also a feminist in terms of equal space being taken up. And we are all influenced by our fathers and our mothers, or the lack thereof of them in our lives. It's like an abandonment wound.
It was also a device that was a relatable subject for a lot of women, of young girls too. Craving male attention and things that are a little more cliche in a sense. That was my intention with the whole film. Tell a simple story well and have it create space for people to be able to have their own feelings with it.
So, yeah, that's the father thing and I'm glad that you noticed that.
TD: Yes,
I did and it felt very much like your own fairy tale that you're telling. Because
most fairy tales, there's always one parent too.
So question for you Anwen, you
delivered a very honest portrayal of Cleo’s struggles of coming into her own
and being her own person. I remember going through that in my late teens, early
20s. My 20s were a mess. How did you get into Cleo’s head?
Anwen O'Driscoll (AO): Well, I feel like anyone can truly, like you were saying, relate deeply to it. And I feel like everyone kind of goes through that thing of finding something that doesn't fit within your world about yourself, and you go and seek outside validation from other people. And that can stem from non-supportive, unhealthy or just like not learned family base, because everyone has these core wounds about themselves. Everyone has core wounds.
And you know, if parents aren't healed enough with theirs or accepting of theirs, it passes on to the child, and then the child will pass it on to their child, and this kind of cycle continues and I feel like I could just relate to the very kind of common human feeling of just seeking outside validation before you know who you are, because when you're younger, you're piecing everything together.
What I always like to say is that we're kind of like paper mache creatures, because we take pieces, especially when we're younger and teenagers, of just like colors and memories and aspects of someone else that we really like, or our parents or our siblings or our best friends or art that we love, and we're just kind of like taking all of these little paper mache pieces and building ourselves as a human with these little moments in time. And I feel like that time is where you're most susceptible to negative things and negative voices in and around you and you don't want to take on those pieces, or you're scared to, but it happens inevitably.
There was a lot of pressure on Cleo to take up the mantle and be a leader and have this life that was completely set up for her, and has been generations and generations of what this is. So she just kind of felt not safe and not able to explore herself as an individual, especially with the fact that her mother has her own core wounds and can't read, but Cleo doesn't know that, because that's a core wound that she won't admit to anyone. Cleo just thinks she just doesn't want to hear her own ideas. So she feels trapped. She's like, “Why would I want to start this life and be this person that was set up for me when you don't even want to hear my ideas? I want some control in my life.”
The pressure is going to make her implode. And eventually, a big outbreak is going to happen, and she’s going to run away and explore and find validation another way. But because she didn't have the tools in her toolbox to properly heal or accept herself, she kind of walked into the exact same situation of hiding again and not being able to show her true colors or talk about her own ideas with Blaze.
She's in a position that's almost the same as when she had her beard in her own community, and just kind of coming to that realization that you need to look within and heal within, to be able to healthily communicate what you want around you and take up your own space. So I just really related to that because it's so human. And I also love fantasy and magic and Jody's an amazing world builder. It’s a beautiful, simple message that everyone experiences and can relate to through this colorful, magical world. I was obsessed with it and wanted to be part of it immediately.
TD: If you were Cleo, would you have stayed and just continued on with the tradition, or do you think you would have probably run away too to break away and figure out what it was you wanted?
AO: I feel like I would have done a similar thing because I have. When I was a little child, I think I ran away because I was like, “Oh, my mom doesn't love me.” Nothing she ever did showed that, because my mom kicks ass and is supportive and an awesome person. But as a child, all of the people around you, their voices get in your head, and if people, if kids, bully you, it really cuts deep. And you don't tell your parents. You just kind of sit with it and live with it because you're embarrassed, and everything around you is just so huge when you're younger. All these experiences - nothing is small, everything is so big and dramatic. So yea, I did the same thing. I ran away with my sister and I think we ran to McDonald's, which was like an hour or two-hour walk in town. Anyway, I came back. I was like, “Sorry, mother.”
I feel like I would do the same thing. I definitely have looked outside for validation, and sometimes catch myself doing it to this day, especially with how social media is structured, and you know, comparing yourself to other people, only seeing the best about people's lives. It's easy to get caught up in that. And it's just about reminding yourself and doing projects like this and working with Jody, who is just fantastic, and I think brilliant. It's just a lovely reminder, because I feel like when I was filming it was a reminder for me as well, which I hope the audience takes away just that - remember to come home to yourself.
TD: For both of you, how important is family and generational traditions in your life?
JW: Family is very important in my life. My family is big and colorful and kind of crazy and all of the things, but very, very important. I grew up in Alberta in a rural kind of setting and in Jasper, which isn't as rural. They always say your first film is very much like an autobiography of some sorts. My family has a huge influence on just the way I think. And I always laugh thinking that the bearded girl is the queer art kid regurgitated life of growing up with cowboys.
I'm the only artist in my whole family. I grew up in a cowboy family, both sides, so there's a lot of horse stuff. Animals are huge in my family. And just allowing people to live the life that makes them happy, the old school kind of cowboy mentality.
AO: My family came from Ireland, like seven generations ago, and we're some of the first white settlers in Banff, Alberta. I think that sense of adventure kind of stayed with us and definitely passed down to me and just wanting to make life as big as I could.
I feel like my family also is very, very quirky. We're all artists. All of us are actors, and my mother's a writer and a director, and my siblings are getting into directing, and we all draw and do art. We work closely together and want to collaborate on projects and films and pictures and stories and things like that. They're my best friends. I'm kind of an introvert and a little bit awkward and have difficulty connecting with people, or sustaining friendships, because I can go into hermit mode. But my whole family's like that, and we're all artists and we relate to each other so deeply and it's always a riot in the house when we get together. They’re my foundation. Family is so important to me, I don't even know where the heck I would be without them.
TD: Absolutely. So, Cleo and Lady Andre are obviously very strong characters to watch. And tghey both have a very strong character arc. But what I really love with the story is there's a lot of smaller, quirky characters that you just kind of latch on to and you're like, Ooh, I like them. They're fun. It just adds to that fun story and imagination and magic. Do both of you have a favorite out of these characters?
JW: The smaller character I get the most excited about on screen is probably Josephine.
TD: Is it from the kid version as well?
JW: Yeah, the conception of that character. Both actresses played her so well and so similarly. I think she's hilarious. Like, when she comes on screen, I get happy, so I think maybe she's my favorite.
AO: I am struggling to pick a favorite, because I think everyone is so unique and different that I feel like I can't choose a favorite. I really love them all. Working with everyone was so incredible and each scene and working with each actor kind of felt like a totally different universe each time, because they just created this different life and energy and pacing. Everyone was so oddball and quirky that I loved it. I laugh at everything Keenan does, who plays Blaze, he's so ridiculous. I love Sky who plays Josephine. I love Jess. I can't choose. I love everyone. They're all just so uniquely different that it's hard to choose. They're all their own different universes.
TD: Yeah, I think that's what made the story that much stronger is you don't have the same personalities throughout. So if you had to have your fortune read today, what do you hope it reveals?
JW: I would hope that it would say that I was going to have a very strong family of my own coming into the picture and that I would be creating and would be able to be making movies constantly for the rest of my life.
AO: Yes, I would hope for a castle my family can live in and make movies and art together for the rest of our lives. A big castle in beautiful, cool mountain country. Yeah, we like magic. I'm very into magic and fantasy. So anything that's kind of like fantastical, I’d love something like that.
TD: For your next projects, are you going to stay within a similar genre or do you plan to go down some different routes? I know Jody, you did the special effects on THE LAST OF US so I’m curious to see what the next thing is coming for both of you. And selfishly I really did enjoy Cleo and would love to see her next chapter. But it's a good story on its own that also doesn’t need a sequel.
JW: I think for me, THE BEARDED GIRL is lighter than a lot of the other stuff that I write. I have a sci-fi series that I've been working on for a while and trying to package up right now. And then I have, like, a period vampire movie that’s a Western and it takes place in a brothel during the gold rush. So they're both a little darker but you'll probably find some dry humor and similar styling. I also made a short called INDIGO. Even though it's very different from THE BEARDED GIRL, it has similar things and style. Those are my two projects that I'm working on.
AO: I have season two of a show that I’m on called BET. We got announced for season two a few weeks ago, so we'll be doing that soon. And it’s an adaptation of a manga universe that already exists and we went into, like a Scott Pilgrim-type editing style and frames. It’s quirky and I'm happy to still be in odd, quirky art making.
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